{"id":2478,"date":"2016-11-13T07:07:46","date_gmt":"2016-11-13T07:07:46","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.monitor-bk.cz\/?p=2478"},"modified":"2016-11-11T04:58:04","modified_gmt":"2016-11-11T04:58:04","slug":"na-kave-s-gabrielou-necasovou","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.monitor-bk.cz\/?p=2478","title":{"rendered":"Na k\u00e1v\u011b s Gabrielou Ne\u010dasovou"},"content":{"rendered":"

\"02_web\"<\/a>O pr\u00e1ci psychologa v Poradn\u011b pro rodinu, man\u017eelstv\u00ed a mezilidsk\u00e9 vztahy v Blansku jsem si pov\u00eddala s jej\u00ed vedouc\u00ed Gabrielou Ne\u010dasovou. Dozv\u011bd\u011bla jsem se, jak\u00e9 p\u0159\u00edpady se mohou v poradn\u011b \u0159e\u0161it a jak\u00fdm zp\u016fsobem klient\u016fm pom\u00e1h\u00e1.\u00a0<\/b><\/p>\n

S jak\u00fdmi institucemi va\u0161e poradna spolupracuje? <\/b>Spolupracujeme zejm\u00e9na s Odd\u011blen\u00edm soci\u00e1ln\u011b pr\u00e1vn\u00ed ochrany d\u011bt\u00ed (OSPOD), jak s blanensk\u00fdm, tak s boskovick\u00fdm. Jsme sou\u010d\u00e1st\u00ed m\u011bstsk\u00e9ho \u00fa\u0159adu, tak\u017ee jsme se neofici\u00e1ln\u011b zav\u00e1zali, \u017ee pro blanensk\u00fd OSPOD m\u00e1me p\u0159ednostn\u00ed term\u00edny. P\u0159\u00edpady, co se tam \u0159e\u0161\u00ed, n\u011bjak\u00fdm zp\u016fsobem ho\u0159\u00ed, jde o z\u00e1jem d\u00edt\u011bte, kter\u00e9 m\u016f\u017ee b\u00fdt ohro\u017eeno. Takov\u00fdm p\u0159\u00edpad\u016fm jsme schopni nab\u00eddnout term\u00edn do t\u00fddne, co\u017e je velk\u00fd nadstandard, proto\u017ee pro ostatn\u00ed nov\u00e9 klienty jsou nyn\u00ed objednac\u00ed lh\u016fty t\u0159i m\u011bs\u00edce.\u00a0<\/p>\n

T\u0159i m\u011bs\u00edce \u2013 to je dlouh\u00e1 doba. Nest\u00e1v\u00e1 se pak, \u017ee u\u017e to pro klienty nen\u00ed aktu\u00e1ln\u00ed? <\/b>Ob\u010das se stane, \u017ee t\u0159eba pak nep\u0159ijdou. Bu\u010f na to zapomenou, nebo se jejich probl\u00e9m s\u00e1m n\u011bjak vy\u0159e\u0161\u00ed, tak\u017ee se omluv\u00ed. Pokud je to n\u011bco velmi akutn\u00edho, \u017eivot ohro\u017euj\u00edc\u00edho, t\u0159eba sebevra\u017eedn\u00e9 \u00famysly, d\u00e1v\u00e1me lidem kontakty na krizov\u00e9 centrum, kter\u00e9 m\u00e1 nonstop provoz v Brn\u011b. \u0158ekla bych, \u017ee v\u0161echno ostatn\u00ed vydr\u017e\u00ed. Dal\u0161\u00ed mo\u017enost je vyu\u017eit\u00ed komer\u010dn\u00edch poradc\u016f, kte\u0159\u00ed maj\u00ed \u010dekac\u00ed lh\u016fty krat\u0161\u00ed, ale jsou to placen\u00e9 slu\u017eby.<\/p>\n

Va\u0161e poradenstv\u00ed je bezplatn\u00e9? <\/b>Ano. Klient u n\u00e1s nic neplat\u00ed.<\/p>\n

Pro\u010d je d\u016fle\u017eit\u00e1 spolupr\u00e1ce s ostatn\u00edmi institucemi? <\/b>Jednotliv\u00e9 instituce si p\u0159\u00edpady r\u016fzn\u011b p\u0159ed\u00e1vaj\u00ed podle toho, do \u010d\u00ed kompetence probl\u00e9m spad\u00e1. Nap\u0159\u00edklad pedagogicko-psychologick\u00e9 poradny jsou v\u00edce orientov\u00e1ny na diagnostiku a na rodinnou terapii nemaj\u00ed moc prostoru. Tak\u017ee pokud naznaj\u00ed, \u017ee je u d\u00edt\u011bte n\u011bjak\u00fd v\u011bt\u0161\u00ed probl\u00e9m, ne\u017e jen zdiagnostikovat ADHD, p\u0159\u00edpadn\u011b n\u011bjak\u00e9 v\u00fdchovn\u00e9 pot\u00ed\u017ee, tak je potom odes\u00edlaj\u00ed do na\u0161\u00ed poradny. Proto je v z\u00e1jmu v\u0161ech stran, abychom se v r\u00e1mci okresu v\u0161ichni znali. U p\u0159\u00edle\u017eitosti T\u00fddne pro rodinu jsme proto v kv\u011btnu v poradn\u011b po\u0159\u00e1dali den otev\u0159en\u00fdch dve\u0159\u00ed. Se\u0161lo se tady zhruba patn\u00e1ct \u0161estn\u00e1ct lid\u00ed \u2013 jednak pracovn\u00edci blanensk\u00e9ho a boskovick\u00e9ho OSPODu, ale tak\u00e9 pracovnice zdej\u0161\u00ed pedagogicko-psychologick\u00e9 poradny. V r\u00e1mci tohoto setk\u00e1n\u00ed jsme jim p\u0159edstavili na\u0161i slu\u017ebu a mluvili jsme o tom, jak\u00e9 jsou na\u0161e mo\u017enosti. Sou\u010dasn\u011b jsme si ale vyjas\u0148ovali i to, jak\u00e9 jsou na\u0161e limity. Ob\u010das se toti\u017e na n\u00e1s lid\u00e9 obracej\u00ed s v\u011bcmi, kter\u00e9 ned\u011bl\u00e1me.\u00a0 Vzhledem k tomu, \u017ee ani j\u00e1 ani kolegyn\u011b nejsme klinick\u00fdmi psychology, ned\u011bl\u00e1me zde nap\u0159. vy\u0161et\u0159en\u00ed psychick\u00e9 zp\u016fsobilosti k z\u00edsk\u00e1n\u00ed zbrojn\u00edho pr\u016fkazu \u010di psychotesty pro \u0159idi\u010de. Obecn\u011b plat\u00ed, \u017ee nejsme diagnostick\u00e9 pracovi\u0161t\u011b a psychologick\u00e1 diagnostika je jen velmi okrajov\u00e1 z\u00e1le\u017eitost na\u0161\u00ed pracovn\u00ed n\u00e1pln\u011b.<\/p>\n

Co tedy ve va\u0161\u00ed poradn\u011b \u0159e\u0161\u00edte? <\/b>Na\u0161e pracovi\u0161t\u011b slou\u017e\u00ed zejm\u00e9na pro dlouhodobou pr\u00e1ci, a to bu\u010f individu\u00e1ln\u00ed, nebo pro p\u00e1ry, p\u0159\u00edpadn\u011b cel\u00e9 rodiny. Jsem rodinn\u011b orientovan\u00fd terapeut, tak\u017ee kdy\u017e p\u0159ijde rodina, \u017ee m\u00e1 probl\u00e9mov\u00e9 d\u00edt\u011b, kter\u00e9 zp\u016fsobuje rozep\u0159e v rodin\u011b a podobn\u011b, stejn\u011b v\u017edycky pracuji s celou rodinou. Nen\u00ed to tak, \u017ee bych si vzala d\u00edt\u011b a \u201ej\u00e1 v\u00e1m ho oprav\u00edm\u201c. Takhle to nefunguje. V\u011bt\u0161inou se do toho sna\u017e\u00edm vt\u00e1hnout v\u0161echny, koho se to t\u00fdk\u00e1, na co\u017e ne v\u017edy rodi\u010de sly\u0161\u00ed. Av\u0161ak obvykle kdy\u017e to zkus\u00ed, zjist\u00ed, \u017ee to funguje.<\/p>\n

Jak\u00fd je pom\u011br individu\u00e1ln\u00edch a spole\u010dn\u00fdch terapi\u00ed? <\/b>Zhruba polovina lid\u00ed p\u0159ijde individu\u00e1ln\u011b. \u010casto i ti, co p\u0159ijdou sami, \u0159e\u0161\u00ed partnersk\u00e9 krize. Bu\u010f u toho partnera necht\u011bj\u00ed, nebo partner nechce p\u0159ij\u00edt. Dal\u0161\u00ed \u0161irokou tematikou jsou deprese a \u00fazkosti. \u010casto se tak\u00e9 objevuj\u00ed lid\u00e9, kte\u0159\u00ed c\u00edt\u00ed, \u017ee pozbyli smysl \u017eivota. P\u00e1rov\u00e9 terapie jsou v\u011bt\u0161inou o n\u011bjak\u00e9 krizi vztahu, a\u0165 u\u017e jsou partne\u0159i nakro\u010deni sm\u011brem k rozvodu, nebo jde o nev\u011bru, kterou se sna\u017e\u00ed p\u0159ekonat a zvl\u00e1dnout spolu. Rodiny jsou nej\u010dast\u011bji pos\u00edl\u00e1ny pr\u00e1v\u011b z OSPODu. M\u00e1lokdy se stane, \u017ee by p\u0159i\u0161la rodina z \u0159ad ve\u0159ejnosti. V\u011bt\u0161inou je to spojeno s rozvodovou problematikou \u010di opatrovnick\u00fdm sporem.<\/p>\n

Co kdy\u017e se rodi\u010de nemohou domluvit na p\u00e9\u010di o d\u011bti po rozvodu? <\/b>Pr\u00e1v\u011b k tomuto \u00fa\u010delu jsme k ruce \u00fa\u0159adu. Pokud se neda\u0159\u00ed ud\u011blat dohody na OSPODu, pos\u00edlaj\u00ed je k n\u00e1m s t\u00edm, \u017ee p\u0159edp\u0159ipravujeme mimosoudn\u00ed dohody o \u00faprav\u011b styku rodi\u010d\u016f s d\u011btmi. D\u00e1le chod\u00ed \u010dasto s t\u00edm, \u017ee po rozvodu d\u00edt\u011b nechce j\u00edt k jednomu nebo druh\u00e9mu z rodi\u010d\u016f. St\u00e1v\u00e1 se \u010dasto, \u017ee d\u00edt\u011b je zmanipulov\u00e1no jednou nebo druhou stranou.<\/p>\n

Jak to \u0159e\u0161\u00edte? <\/b>Hlavn\u011b se sna\u017e\u00edme to vyjas\u0148ovat na \u00farovni rodi\u010d\u016f. Pokud se rodi\u010de domluv\u00ed, d\u00edt\u011b se zpravidla srovn\u00e1 samo. Je d\u016fle\u017eit\u00e9, aby rodi\u010de pochopili, \u017ee o\u010der\u0148ov\u00e1n\u00edm druh\u00e9 strany ubli\u017euj\u00ed a po\u0161kozuj\u00ed zejm\u00e9na d\u00edt\u011b samotn\u00e9. Pracujeme na tom, aby se rodi\u010de nau\u010dili odli\u0161ovat partnerskou a rodi\u010dovskou rovinu sv\u00e9ho vztahu. To, \u017ee p\u0159estali fungovat jako partne\u0159i, nic nem\u011bn\u00ed na tom, \u017ee rodi\u010di u\u017e z\u016fstanou do konce \u017eivota. Nej\u010dast\u011bj\u0161\u00edm t\u00e9matem je pak, zda st\u0159\u00eddav\u00e1 p\u00e9\u010de ano nebo ne.<\/p>\n

Ano nebo ne? <\/b>Ka\u017ed\u00fd terapeut to m\u00e1 trochu jinak. J\u00e1 se v\u017edycky sna\u017e\u00edm podpo\u0159it co nej\u0161ir\u0161\u00ed styk s ob\u011bma rodi\u010di. Nelp\u00edm v\u0161ak na tom, \u017ee to t\u0159eba mus\u00ed b\u00fdt p\u0159esn\u011b t\u00fdden a t\u00fdden. Nejde o konkr\u00e9tn\u00ed po\u010det dn\u00ed, ale o to, aby byli rodi\u010de schopni se domluvit.<\/p>\n

M\u00e1te n\u011bjak\u00fd limit bezplatnosti pro klienta? <\/b>Nem\u00e1me, m\u016f\u017ee chodit, jak dlouho bude pot\u0159ebovat. N\u00e1\u0161 pr\u016fm\u011br je zhruba t\u0159i konzultace na jeden p\u0159\u00edpad. Ale to je pr\u016fm\u011br, n\u011bkomu sta\u010d\u00ed p\u0159ij\u00edt jednou, odnese si radu, kterou pot\u0159eboval, a n\u011bkdo p\u0159ijde desetkr\u00e1t. Ale nen\u00ed to tak, \u017ee by klienti chodili ka\u017ed\u00fd t\u00fdden, na to opravdu nem\u00e1me kapacitu. M\u016f\u017ee to klidn\u011b b\u00fdt deset sezen\u00ed v pr\u016fb\u011bhu dvou let. N\u011bkdy si ve\u0159ejnost p\u0159edstavuje, \u017ee si \u010dlov\u011bk ka\u017ed\u00fd t\u00fdden jde sednout na pohovku…<\/p>\n

Nen\u00ed to tak? <\/b>Z\u00e1le\u017e\u00ed, jak\u00fd m\u00e1 terapeut v\u00fdcvik. Psychodynamicky, freudovsky \u010di jungovsky orientovan\u00fd psycholog si zve lidi ka\u017ed\u00fd t\u00fdden, ale j\u00e1 jsem sp\u00ed\u0161e na opa\u010dn\u00e9m p\u00f3lu. M\u00e1m systemick\u00fd v\u00fdcvik, kde se konzultace bere jako chv\u00edle, v n\u00ed\u017e se zas\u00e9vaj\u00ed zm\u011bny, a mezidob\u00ed je pot\u0159eba na to, aby s nimi klient experimentoval, sna\u017eil se je uplatnit a prov\u011b\u0159il je ka\u017edodenn\u00ed realitou. Pak p\u0159ich\u00e1z\u00ed po m\u011bs\u00edci \u010di po \u0161esti t\u00fddnech s t\u00edm, jak byly nebo nebyly intervence a zm\u011bny u\u017eite\u010dn\u00e9 a domlouv\u00e1me se d\u00e1l. M\u016fj pr\u016fm\u011brn\u00fd \u010dasov\u00fd odstup jednotliv\u00fdch sezen\u00ed je m\u011bs\u00edc s t\u00edm, \u017ee jak terapie pokra\u010duje, sp\u00ed\u0161e se tento interval prodlu\u017euje. Poradenstv\u00ed m\u00e1 sm\u011b\u0159ovat k tomu, aby ho \u010dlov\u011bk co nejd\u0159\u00edv nepot\u0159eboval.<\/p>\n

Jak prob\u00edh\u00e1 sezen\u00ed, m\u00e1 n\u011bjakou strukturu? <\/b>Lehkou strukturu samoz\u0159ejm\u011b m\u00e1me. Zvl\u00e1\u0161t\u011b prvn\u00edch p\u00e1r sezen\u00ed jsme nuceni na z\u00e1klad\u011b na\u0161ich standard\u016f specifikovat takzvanou zak\u00e1zku, tak\u017ee nejprve zji\u0161\u0165uji, co by klient od n\u00e1s r\u00e1d z\u00edskal, co by m\u011blo b\u00fdt v\u00fdsledkem na\u0161\u00ed spolupr\u00e1ce. Prvn\u00ed konzultace se tedy to\u010d\u00ed kolem t\u0159\u00ed z\u00e1kladn\u00edch ot\u00e1zek \u2013 s \u010d\u00edm \u010dlov\u011bk p\u0159ich\u00e1z\u00ed, co by pot\u0159eboval a co by m\u011blo b\u00fdt v\u00fdsledkem. T\u011bmito okruhy se zab\u00fdv\u00e1m tak dlouho, ne\u017e v tom m\u00e1me jasno. To samo o sob\u011b mnohdy sta\u010d\u00ed – klient si ut\u0159\u00edd\u00ed my\u0161lenky a s\u00e1m si p\u0159ijde na to, co chce, a od n\u00e1s v\u00edc nepot\u0159ebuje. Ale n\u011bkdy je nutn\u00e1 dal\u0161\u00ed soustavn\u00e1 pr\u00e1ce, klient pot\u0159ebuje z\u00edskat n\u011bjakou dovednost, p\u0159\u00edpadn\u011b p\u0159ehodnotit n\u011bkter\u00e9 svoje n\u00e1zory. A\u010d jde o poradenstv\u00ed, ned\u00e1v\u00e1m lidem vysloven\u011b rady. Pracuji sp\u00ed\u0161e pomoc\u00ed ot\u00e1zek, kter\u00e9 \u201e\u0161iju klient\u016fm na m\u00edru\u201c. Podstata terapeutick\u00e9ho \u0159emesla spo\u010d\u00edv\u00e1 v technice veden\u00ed rozhovoru, tedy ve volb\u011b a tvorb\u011b vhodn\u00fdch ot\u00e1zek, aby si klient mohl p\u0159ij\u00edt na \u0159e\u0161en\u00ed sv\u00e9ho probl\u00e9mu s\u00e1m. Proto\u017ee neexistuj\u00ed univerz\u00e1ln\u00ed rady, kter\u00e9 by \u0161ly aplikovat na ka\u017ed\u00fd \u017eivot.<\/p>\n

M\u016f\u017eete uv\u00e9st n\u011bjak\u00fd p\u0159\u00edpad, kter\u00fd dok\u00e1\u017eete t\u00edmto zp\u016fsobem \u0159e\u0161it? <\/b>Nap\u0159\u00edklad \u0161ikana. Se \u0161ikanovan\u00fdm \u010dlov\u011bkem prob\u00edr\u00e1m r\u016fzn\u00e9 situace nejd\u0159\u00edve ve smyslu, co je vyvol\u00e1v\u00e1, jak on s\u00e1m tomu rozum\u00ed a jak si vysv\u011btluje, \u017ee okol\u00ed na n\u011bj takhle reaguje. Spole\u010dn\u011b zkoum\u00e1me, kter\u00e9 prvky v jeho chov\u00e1n\u00ed vyvol\u00e1vaj\u00ed agresivn\u00ed reakce okol\u00ed a ty se pak sna\u017e\u00edme nahradit jin\u00fdm chov\u00e1n\u00edm. Kdy\u017e m\u00e1 takov\u00fd \u010dlov\u011bk tendenci se v ur\u010dit\u00fdch situac\u00edch rozbre\u010det, hled\u00e1me zp\u016fsob, jak se nerozbre\u010det. Nebo kdy\u017e se nap\u0159\u00edklad za sebe nepostav\u00ed, ne\u0159ekne sv\u016fj n\u00e1zor a nereaguje na ur\u010dit\u00fd podn\u011bt, hled\u00e1me mo\u017enosti, jak reagovat vhodn\u011bji. Tyto alternativy si klient odn\u00e1\u0161\u00ed z konzultace a v mezidob\u00ed s nimi experimentuje. D\u00e1le pak pracujeme jen s t\u00edm, co se mu osv\u011bd\u010dilo. V\u017edy postupujeme po mal\u00fdch kroc\u00edch \u2013 sebev\u011bdom\u00ed se ned\u00e1 vybudovat ze dne na den. Velmi r\u00e1da vyu\u017e\u00edv\u00e1m p\u0159i pr\u00e1ci metafory, zejm\u00e9na d\u011bti na n\u011b velmi dob\u0159e reaguj\u00ed. Jedno d\u00edt\u011b nap\u0159\u00edklad za\u010dalo m\u00edt zni\u010dehonic strach jezdit hromadnou dopravou. Sv\u016fj probl\u00e9m popisovalo slovy, \u017ee \u201eztratilo jistotu, a za\u010dalo se b\u00e1t\u201c.\u00a0 Za\u010dala jsem s d\u00edt\u011btem hledat, co by mohlo b\u00fdt nov\u00fdm sem\u00ednkem jistoty, kter\u00e9 bychom mohli zasadit, jakou p\u00e9\u010di by takov\u00e9 sem\u00ednko pot\u0159ebovalo, aby mohlo vzej\u00edt. Kdy\u017e n\u00e1m vze\u0161lo, hledali jsme zp\u016fsob, jak ho zal\u00e9vat a hnojit, aby vykvetlo.\u00a0 V z\u00e1v\u011bru spolupr\u00e1ce jsme ji\u017e vzrostlou kv\u011btinu jistoty ope\u010dov\u00e1vali tak, aby neuvadla \u010di neuschla. D\u00edt\u011b velmi hezky nach\u00e1zelo paralely s metaforou ve sv\u00e9m ka\u017edodenn\u00edm \u017eivot\u011b.<\/p>\n

Marie Haso\u0148ov\u00e1<\/b><\/p>\n

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